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What regulatory power should a strong
disability accessibility law include?

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David Lepofsky, chair, accessibility for
Ontarians

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with disabilities act alliance, delivered
at the

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Osgoode Hall Law School, January 15, 2014
as a Roy McMurtry clinical fellow.

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Thank you very much.

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It's always great to come back to Osgood
and it's especially

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delightful to have been honored by Osgood
as having been selected as

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the Roight McMurtury clinical fellow, I'll
be here for four weeks giving

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lectures in various courses and available
to students on an informal basis.

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Twenty years ago this November on 29th

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November 1994, about 20 of us interested
in disability human rights accessibility

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they like ended up through an odd chain of
events

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in a room together at the Ontario
legislature Queens Park.

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When we went in the room we each knew that
we needed something new to be

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done to change our society, to make it

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one in which people with disabilities
could fully participate.

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We knew we needed a new law, but we had no
idea what that law would be.

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And we had no reasonable expectation that
we'd ever win it.

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We went in that room just to talk about
what to do.

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We came out of that room an hour and a
half later having formed a new coalition.

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Weeks later I became its co-chair and then
its chair.

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And the next 20 years were history.

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A decade after that event the Ontario
legislature unanimously passed the

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Accessibility for Ontarian with
Disabilities Act

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2005 with all party approval, unanimously.

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Four years earlier it had passed the
Ontarians with disabilities act 2001 but

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two opposition parties, the liberals and
NDP

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voted against it as being grossly
inadequate.

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What I'd like to do today is not to talk
to you about the political process

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of, of advocating for this kind of
legislation,

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or the community organization strategy
that brought people

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with disabilities from one end of this
province

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to the other together, together, to fight
for

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it, nor do I propose to review the

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substance of the gains on accessibility
we've won in

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the eight years since the AODA 2005 was
passed.

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They will be the subject of other lectures
that I'll be giving while I'm

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here at Osgood and we hope will

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be available for longer term use through
YouTube.

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What I'd like to do with you over the the
next few minutes we have together.

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Is to talk very specifically about the
regulatory strategy,

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the policy, the contents, the guts of the
AODA.

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What we decided to see, how we decided to,
to

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to map that out, how we figured out what
to see.

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What we got in 2005 and since then, what

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changes we've been able to get to seek and
to get and how that regime is implemented.

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This is all about process.

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The substance is, of course, critically
important,

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I'll be addressing that later, in the

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end I will tell you through the totality
of the lectures I'll be giving.

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We've come a long way in terms of getting

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this legislation on the books, as a
community organizing strategy.

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And I believe we've come a significant

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distance, since the enactment of the
legislation and

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moving us forward, but we are way behind

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schedule at achieving the goal of full
accessibility.

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Before I jump into how we crafted our
proposals for this

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legislation and what the government did
with those proposals, it's important

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for me to just take a moment or two to
tell

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you about the social problem that this law
aims to fix.

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Put simply, the, at least 18, 17 or 18% of
the population of Ontario, over

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1.8 million Ontarians, right now have a

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physical, or a mental, or a sensory
disability.

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That might be, young folks or, children
born with a disability, older folks who

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acquire one through the aging process, or,
or through accident or injury.

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However, our numbers are not static,
they're growing.

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The proportion of Ontario's public, and

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Canada's public, and even the world's
population

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that has a disability is growing because
the greatest cause of disability is aging.

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And our population is disproportionately
getting older.

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So we will have more and more, or a
greater proportion of our

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study will have disabilities in the next
ten years, than do right now.

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These folks, people with a physical, or a
mental, or a sensory disability face

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barriers every day of their lives, whether
they're trying to get a job, or

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an education, or use public transit, or
buy goods or services, or

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take part in any other aspect of, of our
society that other folks take for granted.

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Some of those barriers are physical, like
steps to

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get into a, a bus or a, a building.

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Some of them are information barriers,
like

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the lack of braille on some elevator
buttons.

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Some of those, barriers are communication
barrios, the lack of,

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communication supports, like sign language

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interpretation for people with hearing
loss.

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In situations were they needed to be able
to

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benefit from a good or a service, or
employment.

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Some of the barriers are, are,

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bureaucratic, some are legal, some are
attitudinal.

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So,

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in a nutshell people with disabilities
face too many barriers.

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And as a result, they're excluded,
disproportionately, from so

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much of our society, and what it has to
offer.

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And they end up disproportionately
over-represented among

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the poor and the welfare defen-,
dependent.

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And under-represented among the educated
and the employed.

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That's the problem.

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The barriers we face ultimately hurt
everybody, because everybody

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either has a disability now or will get
one eventually.

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We are the minority of everyone.

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Everyone has a disability, has someone
near to them, dear

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to them who has a disability or will get
one.

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Now, it happens that these barriers are
all illegal.

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They're all illegal.

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They violate in the case of the public or
private sector, the Human Rights

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Codes guarantees of non-discrimination and
access to

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employment, housing, goods and services,
and facilities.

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And in the case of government, the
guarantee of equality to people

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with disabilities in section 15 of the
Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

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The problem that led 20 people to end up
in that

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room in Queens Park, on November 29, 1994,
was even though

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they're all illeg-,they're, they're pretty
much all illegal, they too often,

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far too often, a vast majority of the
time, those barriers remain.

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And as quickly as old barriers might be
torn down, new ones are popping up.

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Why is that?

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There are two reasons.

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This underpins everything I'll be talking
to you about.

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The first is that those laws, the

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Human Rights Code and the Charter, while
wonderfully

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interpreted by our courts for the most
part,

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after some bumpy starts, are way too
vague.

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They don't tell an organization what to
do.

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If you walked up to a restaurant owner and
said: "You don't have a braille menu here

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so you are, violating the human rights
code",

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they'd look at you probably like you were
crazy.

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They wouldn't have the first idea, that
they're violating the human rights code.

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Same with many, if not most of the
barrier.

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And the second problem, so the first
problem is that organizations for the most

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part don't know what they have to do or
don't know they're in breach of the law.

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The charter and the human rights code
speak

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in very broad terms, don't discriminate,
do accommodate.

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But they don't tell people the specifics
of what

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they've gotta do and when they gotta do
them by.

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The second problem is, whether or not an
organization

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knows they've got to, they're, they're
violating the law.

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The fact is, if you want to enforce

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your rights, you've gotta bring individual
cases or complaints,

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either under the human rights code, or
under

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the charter to fight barriers one at a
time.

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Most people with disabilities are poor,

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unemployed, disproportionately
underrepresented by the legal

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profession, or not likely to be able to
avail themselves of that process.

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I've used it myself.

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I had to bring that one to two cases to
get, under the

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human rights code, to force the TTC
audibly announce all bus and subway stops.

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It's not a fun process.

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many, most won't vote themselves for that,
undertaking that hardship.

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So, that's the problem.

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This led to 20 people to come into a room,
say, we need a new law to fix it.

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Initially, the name we wanted for that law
was the Ontarians with Disabilities Act.

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The named changed over time for reasons
that

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don't matter for purposes of our present
discussion.

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But when we enter that room we didn't have
the slightest

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idea what we wanted the law to contain or
to do.

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We didn't know about any of the detail, we
hadn't figured out any of the details.

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That came later.

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We made a strategic decision early on when
we formed our coalition,

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which I ended up starting out as co-chair
and as I

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said to this date end up in, in a chair
role.

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First, the original coalition, the
Ontarians with Disabilites Act Committee

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up to 2005 and then, it's successor, the
Accessibility for

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Ontarians with Disabilities Act Alliance,
from 2000, formed that year

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and I became it's chair in 2009 to the
present.

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But in any event, we decided early on that
we weren't

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gonna get involved in the details of what
the legislation would contain

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until we had a government at the table who
really wanted to talk

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business with us.

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Let me jump forward to 2003.

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In 2003, the Ontario Liberal Party, by

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the way, we're non-partisan, we'll work
with anyone.

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But the Ontario Liberal Party was elected
on an election

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commitment to us to enact a disabilities
act that would cover

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disabil, barriers in the public and
private sector that would be

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effectively enforced and would, involve
key principles that we put forward.

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That was when we realized that we now have
to

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be ready in a serious way to get into
detail.

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We'd done some policy development up 'til
then.

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But 2003 is when we especially had to turn
our attention to the question of,

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of how this legislation, or what regime

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or compliance and enforcement we would
use, in this legislation.

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What I'd like to do now is to tell you
about the process we use for

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coming up with our ideas, what we got from
the government, and the specific,

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some of the specific changes that we've
had made to it since the law was passed in

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2005, in order to correct problems that
we've identified.

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So, 2003 rolls around.

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We knew what the goal of our legislation
was:

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removing and preventing these barriers,
achieving a fully accessible society.

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We ultimately knew that we wanted to, not
to change the rights guaranteed

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in the charter of the Human Rights Code to
people with disabilities, but

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simply to come up with a way to have them
effectively implemented in

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the public and private sectors without
having to litigate barriers one at a time.

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So, we need to figure out how to do this.

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I had a problem which is, as the chair

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of the coalition, I didn't have all the
answers.

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I happened to be a, part-time faculty at
Os,

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at UT, teaching a course on freedom of
expression.

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So I approached some faculty members
there, including a

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fellow named Lauren Saulson, and a couple
of other faculty

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members and we pulled together,
essentially a team, I

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called it the brains trust, to come up
with ideas.

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We worked together over weeks, and these
folk were,

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well, dedicated and generous with their
time and extremely creative.

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As a result, we developed a discussion
paper which we put

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up on our website and emailed out, in June
of 2004.

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It tackled a series of issues.

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The issues we identified, included these.

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First.

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What exact model for compliance are we
gonna use?

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Are we gonna require organizations to
develop accessibility plans,

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and then just police the quality of those
plans?

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Or are we going to develop a system of
accessibility standards

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or are we gonna use both?

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Well, we have some experience to draw on
'cause in 2001 a

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couple years before when the Conservative
Party was in power in Ontario

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and Mike Harris was the Premier, they' d
committed to pass a

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Disabilities Act, but were very reluctant
to, include any teeth in it.

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Excuse me.

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They passed a law in 2001, a very weak

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one, called the Ontarians With
Disabilities Act in 2001.

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It only applied to the public sector.

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It did not require the private sector to
do anything.

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And in the public sector, all it required
organizations to do,

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whether government ministries,
universities, colleges, hospitals,

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public transit authorities and the like,

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all it required them to do was to annually
develop and make

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public an accessibility plan of the
barriers they were prepared to address.

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It didn't require to be, the plans to be
any good

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and it didn't require these organization
to ever implement their plans.

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They just had to make a plan, whatever it
was, and make it public.

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We learned from that experience, that
planning alone wasn't enough.

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And indeed, organizations that were bound
to provi-, develop these plans agreed

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00:14:53,030 --> 00:14:58,240
in a number of cases that they didn't want
to each have to reinvent

231
00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:02,760
the accessibility wheel, organization by
organization.

232
00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:08,420
And, interestingly, we ended up having a
common view

233
00:15:08,420 --> 00:15:12,660
from our coalition, then called the
Ontarians with Disabilities

234
00:15:12,660 --> 00:15:17,300
Committee, in some of the obligated
sectors, that the

235
00:15:17,300 --> 00:15:20,700
way to solve this was to set some common
standard.

236
00:15:20,700 --> 00:15:23,610
That would tell organizations exactly what
they gotta do and

237
00:15:23,610 --> 00:15:26,990
when they gotta do it by in order to
achieve accessibility.

238
00:15:29,580 --> 00:15:31,100
Now we could have had a law,

239
00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,560
that both set a requirement for

240
00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:42,450
accessibility planning and, required
accessibility standards.

241
00:15:42,450 --> 00:15:44,530
And in fact, that's what we ended up
asking for.

242
00:15:45,790 --> 00:15:49,106
But we mapped out both options in our
discussion paper.

243
00:15:51,945 --> 00:15:55,709
In coming up with these ideas, like, where
do you get these kind of ideas from?

244
00:15:57,130 --> 00:16:00,130
There isn't sort of an off-the-shelf, no
other province

245
00:16:00,130 --> 00:16:02,490
had a disabilities act that we could look
to.

246
00:16:02,490 --> 00:16:05,410
And other legislation around the world, we
did look to it.

247
00:16:05,410 --> 00:16:07,950
But other legislature around the world had
often

248
00:16:07,950 --> 00:16:11,240
had parts of law, of legislation, we
already had.

249
00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:15,110
There was a law called the Americans with
Disabilities Act passed in 1990.

250
00:16:15,110 --> 00:16:18,870
It's got a lot of good things in it, it's
got some limitations.

251
00:16:18,870 --> 00:16:22,020
It included, and, and we stole the name
from that,

252
00:16:22,020 --> 00:16:25,230
Ontarians with Disabilities Act came from
Americans with Disabilities Act.

253
00:16:25,230 --> 00:16:28,900
But, we that law, a key part of it is

254
00:16:28,900 --> 00:16:31,860
just the right to sue for discrimination
based on disability.

255
00:16:31,860 --> 00:16:34,390
Well, we've had that since 1982 in
Ontario.

256
00:16:36,020 --> 00:16:40,609
But we found that it does, it did include
some useful features.

257
00:16:41,660 --> 00:16:44,550
Especially the requirement, or the power
of

258
00:16:44,550 --> 00:16:46,840
the state, of the federal government to
develop

259
00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:50,270
and implement accessibility standards in
different sectors and

260
00:16:50,270 --> 00:16:51,890
to tell organizations what they've got to
do.

261
00:16:52,940 --> 00:16:55,670
That was helpful, but it only got you a
certain distance.

262
00:16:55,670 --> 00:16:59,130
The, the Americans with Disabilities Act
was, there was some controversy about

263
00:16:59,130 --> 00:17:02,350
it, how effective it is, did it really
work and so on.

264
00:17:02,350 --> 00:17:09,020
So, when I sat down with our, with with
then Professor Saucin

265
00:17:09,020 --> 00:17:14,870
and our brains trust, I said well does
anybody sort of study

266
00:17:14,870 --> 00:17:20,720
comparative regulatory regimes in an
administrative law to find out what works?

267
00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:23,520
And the answer was no, we don't really do
that.

268
00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:27,406
We have different people who study
principles and judicial review or

269
00:17:27,406 --> 00:17:33,160
look at specific areas, like environmental
law, or securities regulation or whatever.

270
00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:36,420
But we couldn't find anyone who had been

271
00:17:36,420 --> 00:17:39,490
looking across the board at different
regulatory sectors,

272
00:17:39,490 --> 00:17:41,408
or regulatory regimes, to tell us which
ones

273
00:17:41,408 --> 00:17:45,470
work and which ones work better than
others.

274
00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:48,830
So that wasn't gonna be a solution.

275
00:17:50,670 --> 00:17:54,050
And if you talk to individual private
sector or even public

276
00:17:54,050 --> 00:17:56,940
sector administrative lawyers, they will
litigate

277
00:17:56,940 --> 00:18:01,700
individual cases under Administrative Law
Principle.

278
00:18:02,870 --> 00:18:04,680
And they, they don't look at the big
picture.

279
00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:06,540
They, they tend to, I don't mean that as

280
00:18:06,540 --> 00:18:10,060
a criticism, they focus on an individual
dispute under

281
00:18:10,060 --> 00:18:11,750
a law they've already got a deal with,
whether

282
00:18:11,750 --> 00:18:13,590
it's a labor law or whatever it may be.

283
00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:18,410
So they weren't really in a position to
help us too much either.

284
00:18:18,410 --> 00:18:23,860
And, human rights scholars spent most of
their time, studying what the human rights

285
00:18:23,860 --> 00:18:25,410
code says and how it should be

286
00:18:25,410 --> 00:18:29,340
interpreted or analyzing the outcomes of
individual cases.

287
00:18:29,340 --> 00:18:34,360
And we didn't find from them a lot of
guidance on how to design a new system.

288
00:18:34,360 --> 00:18:37,620
So what our brains trust came up with as
an idea is let's, let's

289
00:18:37,620 --> 00:18:40,130
just try to figure out what regulatory

290
00:18:40,130 --> 00:18:44,050
systems, or laws deal, with a similar
problem.

291
00:18:45,310 --> 00:18:49,650
And the two that, that then Professor
Saucin, before

292
00:18:49,650 --> 00:18:52,920
he got elevated to his current lofty
height as Dean,

293
00:18:56,250 --> 00:18:59,329
they came up with this idea of two regimes
to look at.

294
00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:05,590
One was environmental laws, and the other
was occupational health and safety laws.

295
00:19:05,590 --> 00:19:08,300
And the reason that those two came up was
because they're not

296
00:19:08,300 --> 00:19:11,940
identical to the issue we're talking about
here, but they cut across

297
00:19:11,940 --> 00:19:15,910
a lot of businesses, a lot of
organizations, public and private sector,

298
00:19:15,910 --> 00:19:19,449
and between the two of them, they deal
with relatively complicated issues.

299
00:19:21,150 --> 00:19:23,090
That effect real people.

300
00:19:23,090 --> 00:19:25,590
It may be complicated to deal with
different

301
00:19:25,590 --> 00:19:29,710
kind of pollutions but toxins hurt real
people.

302
00:19:29,710 --> 00:19:31,760
An occupational health and safety you can
also

303
00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:34,560
get into complicated issues of what type
of machinery

304
00:19:34,560 --> 00:19:38,500
is being used and what kind of safety re
measures are in place and all that stuff.

305
00:19:38,500 --> 00:19:42,290
But ultimately, you're trying to ensure
that workers don't get hurt, so we had

306
00:19:42,290 --> 00:19:50,540
both real, real people problems, and
complex business settings.

307
00:19:50,540 --> 00:19:56,140
And it was from those two regimes that we
cobbled together, our ideas.

308
00:19:56,140 --> 00:19:59,140
We put out an options paper, a discussion
paper,

309
00:19:59,140 --> 00:20:03,630
in the summer of 2004, and well time
doesn't

310
00:20:03,630 --> 00:20:08,210
permit me to get into this here, I, I'll
just tell you in a, in a, in a nutshell.

311
00:20:09,270 --> 00:20:15,710
I continue constantly to be, impressed and
delighted, at how

312
00:20:15,710 --> 00:20:19,820
many disability community organization,
how many individuals with disabilities,

313
00:20:19,820 --> 00:20:22,880
and individuals without disabilities, will
review this stuff that

314
00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:25,750
lawyers would think of as being dry boring
and technical.

315
00:20:27,360 --> 00:20:30,370
Would dig into it, come up with
interesting

316
00:20:30,370 --> 00:20:33,180
ideas based on it and make really good
recommendations.

317
00:20:34,690 --> 00:20:37,290
And they did, drawing on this discretion
paper when

318
00:20:37,290 --> 00:20:40,610
it came time to get submissions to
interior government.

319
00:20:40,610 --> 00:20:41,980
So.

320
00:20:41,980 --> 00:20:45,210
We worked together, came up with this
discussion paper and circulate it.

321
00:20:47,210 --> 00:20:51,830
In terms and two of the main ideas that we
were proposing, there are others,

322
00:20:51,830 --> 00:20:54,080
but the two that main ideas was

323
00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:57,840
the idea of developing and implementing
accessibility standards.

324
00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,190
And having a regime for accessibility
planning.

325
00:21:02,310 --> 00:21:05,250
Standards address the need by saying it.

326
00:21:05,250 --> 00:21:06,720
Organizations don't know what they have to
do or when

327
00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:08,600
they got to do it by, a standard will tell
them.

328
00:21:12,050 --> 00:21:15,480
Organizations often, if you point out a
barrier in an

329
00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:19,010
organization, typically their answer is,
oh, we never thought of that.

330
00:21:19,010 --> 00:21:21,990
A restaurant that doesn't have a braille
menu in't s 'cause they

331
00:21:21,990 --> 00:21:25,150
sat down and said, let's make sure we
never have braille menus.

332
00:21:25,150 --> 00:21:28,990
And we want to make sure blind people
can't, read our menu.

333
00:21:28,990 --> 00:21:30,720
They never thought of it before.

334
00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:34,990
So if the answer was, if the common
experience was, we didn't think

335
00:21:34,990 --> 00:21:39,489
of it, accessibility planning is designed
to require them to think about it.

336
00:21:42,130 --> 00:21:46,410
That's how we crafted sort of the, the,
the, the guts of our proposal.

337
00:21:49,330 --> 00:21:52,380
Now, when it came time for the government
to develop it's lie it

338
00:21:52,380 --> 00:21:55,680
took our discussion paper, and got input
from the public, and it came with

339
00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:59,890
proposals, which it introduced in a bill
in the interial legislature, a proposed

340
00:21:59,890 --> 00:22:02,940
accessibility for Ontarians with
disabilities act [INAUDIBLE]

341
00:22:02,940 --> 00:22:04,500
because they gave it a new name.

342
00:22:04,500 --> 00:22:07,230
Because the, the conservatives passed the
Onatarians with Disabilities Act,

343
00:22:07,230 --> 00:22:09,350
and so they wanted a new name, so they
called

344
00:22:09,350 --> 00:22:11,540
it the Accessibility for Ontarians with
Disabilities Act, that's why

345
00:22:11,540 --> 00:22:13,410
we have these two different laws by two
different names.

346
00:22:14,630 --> 00:22:18,340
And then they held public hearings where
we again, could have input.

347
00:22:18,340 --> 00:22:21,250
And we used the, the, the guts of the
proposals

348
00:22:21,250 --> 00:22:23,830
we used, we developed in that discussion
paper that summer

349
00:22:23,830 --> 00:22:26,030
to inform the proposals that we came
forward with for

350
00:22:26,030 --> 00:22:30,320
amending that legislation, which
ultimately, passed in May of 2005.

351
00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:32,060
So, what did we get?

352
00:22:32,060 --> 00:22:33,070
What came out in the law?

353
00:22:33,070 --> 00:22:36,050
What, what is the essence of this
legislative regime?

354
00:22:36,050 --> 00:22:37,540
Well it has a number of key components.

355
00:22:38,780 --> 00:22:38,970
I summarize.

356
00:22:38,970 --> 00:22:44,480
Number one, the goal of the legislation,
stated in the law, is that Ontario is

357
00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:49,056
to become fully accessible to people with
disabilities by or before 2025.

358
00:22:50,650 --> 00:22:53,620
I wanna tell you, the idea of a deadline
was not our idea.

359
00:22:53,620 --> 00:22:57,480
I'd love to claim credit, say wasn't that
brilliant of us.

360
00:22:57,480 --> 00:22:58,260
We never thought of it.

361
00:22:58,260 --> 00:23:00,370
It was actually an idea that came from

362
00:23:00,370 --> 00:23:02,470
within the government, and it was a superb
idea.

363
00:23:02,470 --> 00:23:05,860
It's had a dramatic impact since,'cause
the moment this law passed, we said

364
00:23:05,860 --> 00:23:10,090
the clock started ticking, and our
constant refrain is, are we on schedule?

365
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:34,280
Accessibility standards.

366
00:23:36,340 --> 00:23:37,800
What is an accessibility standard?

367
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:40,030
It's a regulation that will see, speak to

368
00:23:40,030 --> 00:23:43,880
either one sector of the economy,
transportation or

369
00:23:43,880 --> 00:23:46,690
something like that, or one swathe of
human

370
00:23:46,690 --> 00:23:50,110
activity that cuts across all
organizations, like employment.

371
00:23:50,110 --> 00:23:55,150
Tell them what barriers to remove, when
they have to remove them by, and so on.

372
00:23:56,220 --> 00:24:00,700
The law provided that, different, that,
that standards

373
00:24:00,700 --> 00:24:02,300
didn't have to be one size fits all.

374
00:24:02,300 --> 00:24:05,550
It wasn't simply saying everybody must
accomplish X by this date.

375
00:24:05,550 --> 00:24:06,980
It could take into account whether an

376
00:24:06,980 --> 00:24:09,390
organization's public sector or private
sector, whether

377
00:24:09,390 --> 00:24:11,080
it's large or small, and it can

378
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:13,140
set different requirements, and different
time line.

379
00:24:15,190 --> 00:24:16,150
We agreed with all of those.

380
00:24:18,430 --> 00:24:20,940
How were the standards to be developed?

381
00:24:20,940 --> 00:24:22,020
This is really an important thing.

382
00:24:22,020 --> 00:24:24,970
Usually regulations are just things that
public servants work on,

383
00:24:24,970 --> 00:24:27,509
develop, they go to cabinet, they are
approved, and that's that.

384
00:24:28,570 --> 00:24:29,780
We, in our discussions with the

385
00:24:29,780 --> 00:24:32,530
government, and arising from the, the
excellent

386
00:24:32,530 --> 00:24:37,510
assistance that we got from our Brains
Trust at leading up to this.

387
00:24:37,510 --> 00:24:41,310
We said that these should not just be
invented at Queens Park.

388
00:24:41,310 --> 00:24:44,370
We need a system in place for how these
standards are made.

389
00:24:46,350 --> 00:24:48,180
Here's how the system goes.

390
00:24:48,180 --> 00:24:53,410
First, the government has a mandate to
decide which standards will be developed.

391
00:24:55,470 --> 00:25:00,380
And it has a free hand to do this, but it
has an obligation in the legislation to

392
00:25:00,380 --> 00:25:06,140
make all the standards needed to get to
the law's goal, the statute's goal.

393
00:25:06,140 --> 00:25:08,920
And that goal is full accessibility by
2025.

394
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:11,630
So, we could turn to the government at any
time and say,"

395
00:25:11,630 --> 00:25:15,908
Have you made all the standards needed to
get us to that goal?"

396
00:25:15,908 --> 00:25:20,490
Or, in turn,if every organization complies
with all the standards you've

397
00:25:20,490 --> 00:25:24,580
made, will we achieve that goal of full
accessibility by 2025?"

398
00:25:24,580 --> 00:25:28,270
It's in the law, it's where typically
Legislation says

399
00:25:28,270 --> 00:25:31,060
government may make regulations, here it
said it must.

400
00:25:32,170 --> 00:25:33,340
And it put a test forward.

401
00:25:35,300 --> 00:25:37,370
Well, how are the standards gonna be made?

402
00:25:37,370 --> 00:25:39,620
Well, our discussions with government, we
said that, really there

403
00:25:39,620 --> 00:25:41,870
are two sources of wisdom the government
should draw on.

404
00:25:42,870 --> 00:25:46,440
People who know the most about people with
disabilities.

405
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:48,330
And that's people with disability.

406
00:25:48,330 --> 00:25:50,420
And people who know the most about how to

407
00:25:50,420 --> 00:25:53,460
run an organization and that's people who
run organizations.

408
00:25:53,460 --> 00:25:56,300
So we said why don't you set up a
committee

409
00:25:56,300 --> 00:26:00,200
for each standard, then call it a
standards development committee?

410
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:03,100
And on it there'll be representatives from
the obligated

411
00:26:03,100 --> 00:26:06,730
sectors, from the public sector, from
business and so on.

412
00:26:06,730 --> 00:26:08,130
And from people with disabilities.

413
00:26:08,130 --> 00:26:09,770
They'll put their heads together, put

414
00:26:09,770 --> 00:26:12,440
together proposals, submit them to
government

415
00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:18,620
and the government will be, and then
decide whether it

416
00:26:18,620 --> 00:26:21,670
wants to enact the proposals in whole or
in part.

417
00:26:21,670 --> 00:26:23,680
Once enacted it's a law.

418
00:26:25,910 --> 00:26:29,290
And under this regime, the government, the
standards development committees.

419
00:26:30,340 --> 00:26:33,950
After five years are to review the
standard that

420
00:26:33,950 --> 00:26:35,370
was first made so that we can see if

421
00:26:35,370 --> 00:26:36,820
changes need to be made to make sure that

422
00:26:36,820 --> 00:26:39,930
we get to that goal of full accessibility
by 2025.

423
00:26:39,930 --> 00:26:45,080
That was the basic regime, well next comes
an important policy question.

424
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:46,750
How are you gonna make sure this is the
works?

425
00:26:48,380 --> 00:26:51,810
You don't wanna end up on Christmas Eve
2024 and find

426
00:26:51,810 --> 00:26:56,390
out, oh shucks, we kind of haven't, we're
nowhere near there.

427
00:26:56,390 --> 00:27:00,940
So there were several accountability
mechanisms built into the law.

428
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:07,830
first, when standards of [UNKNOWN]
committees meet

429
00:27:07,830 --> 00:27:08,910
they have to keep minutes and they

430
00:27:08,910 --> 00:27:11,810
have to make the minutes public, so we can
know what's going on there.

431
00:27:11,810 --> 00:27:13,570
We wanted them to actually meet in public.

432
00:27:13,570 --> 00:27:15,440
The government wouldn't agree with that.

433
00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:19,650
So the secondary their, their fallback was
to have these minutes.

434
00:27:19,650 --> 00:27:21,930
Second, when is standards committee makes
a

435
00:27:21,930 --> 00:27:26,160
recommendation, it makes it first a
preliminary recommendation.

436
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:27,200
That's made public.

437
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:28,490
We give input.

438
00:27:28,490 --> 00:27:29,940
They then review our input.

439
00:27:29,940 --> 00:27:32,090
They make final recommendation.

440
00:27:32,090 --> 00:27:34,890
That's made public, and before the
government can enact a

441
00:27:34,890 --> 00:27:38,920
regulation, it's gotta make a draft
regulation public, as well.

442
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:40,570
And we can give input on that.

443
00:27:40,570 --> 00:27:42,160
On one level, you may say, man that's a
lot of

444
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:47,300
giving input, but through this process, we
can see what's being considered.

445
00:27:48,450 --> 00:27:51,700
And we can give input as can the obligated
sectors.

446
00:27:51,700 --> 00:27:55,840
And if the government is widdling or
wittling things down we can track that.

447
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:58,290
And see how much they are prepared to do
compared to how much they

448
00:27:58,290 --> 00:28:02,360
were urged to do by the very people they
appointed to develop these standards.

449
00:28:03,470 --> 00:28:05,620
The next accountablity mechanism that's
built in,

450
00:28:05,620 --> 00:28:08,290
is that the minister responsible for this

451
00:28:08,290 --> 00:28:11,870
legislagsion has to make an annual report
to legislature on how things are going.

452
00:28:11,870 --> 00:28:14,290
By the way by the way we didn't hold our
breathe on that one

453
00:28:14,290 --> 00:28:15,670
because they tend to write these self

454
00:28:15,670 --> 00:28:18,400
serving aren't we doing a wonderful job
statements.

455
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,640
Which is basically what's happened, every
year.

456
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:25,670
But there was one other accountability
mechanism that was

457
00:28:25,670 --> 00:28:27,440
built into this law and it's a really
important one.

458
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:33,100
There's a requirement in this law that
every few years After, first after

459
00:28:33,100 --> 00:28:36,640
three years after the law was enacted, and
then every four years after that.

460
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:38,680
The government has to appoint an
independent person

461
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:43,090
to review how the law's working and make
recommendations.

462
00:28:43,090 --> 00:28:45,340
Essentially to see if we're on track and
on schedule.

463
00:28:46,370 --> 00:28:48,520
The first independent review took place in
2010

464
00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:52,240
and the second one as what I mentioned is

465
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:55,670
going on right now under the hospices of

466
00:28:55,670 --> 00:28:58,680
Dean Mayo Moran of the UOFT faculty of
law.

467
00:29:00,260 --> 00:29:03,890
So that was the basic framework of the
law.

468
00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:06,150
How's it going to be enforced?

469
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,770
Well, if you go back to our discussion
paper we relayed

470
00:29:09,770 --> 00:29:13,250
out a whole range of options, like the
human rights commission.

471
00:29:13,250 --> 00:29:16,040
Or by the government or by an independent
agency.

472
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:17,580
We ended up urging that the

473
00:29:17,580 --> 00:29:20,300
government appoint an independent arms
length enforcement

474
00:29:20,300 --> 00:29:27,680
agency with powers to audit, inspect,
issue compliance orders and, and so on.

475
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:31,610
And then have an independent tribunal that
the the complaints could be appealed to.

476
00:29:32,860 --> 00:29:34,910
The government agreed to incorporate in

477
00:29:34,910 --> 00:29:38,870
the law powers of, compliance orders,
inspections,

478
00:29:38,870 --> 00:29:44,630
pardon me, audits, and monetary penalties
including a potentially a very steep one.

479
00:29:44,630 --> 00:29:47,200
But did not make this independent.

480
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:51,420
Rather it's managed by a body called the
Accessibility Director of Ontario.

481
00:29:51,420 --> 00:29:55,580
Statutorily created, but part of a
government ministry.

482
00:29:56,630 --> 00:29:59,420
Excuse me, accountable to a cabinet
minister.

483
00:29:59,420 --> 00:30:00,330
So that's the regime.

484
00:30:02,860 --> 00:30:05,500
Well, 2005 passed unanimously.

485
00:30:05,500 --> 00:30:07,120
We all celebrate.

486
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:07,900
How did it go?

487
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,310
Let me take, break this into different
chunks of time.

488
00:30:11,310 --> 00:30:12,550
2005 to 2007.

489
00:30:12,550 --> 00:30:13,850
It starts out,

490
00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:19,900
actually very well, the government quickly
decided that there

491
00:30:19,900 --> 00:30:23,690
were five accessibility standards that
need to be made first.

492
00:30:23,690 --> 00:30:26,176
The five they picked were very good
choices.

493
00:30:26,176 --> 00:30:31,927
Customer service, transportation,
employment.

494
00:30:33,090 --> 00:30:38,060
The built environment in information and
communications.

495
00:30:38,060 --> 00:30:39,420
Top grades for their choice.

496
00:30:41,430 --> 00:30:44,340
And they appointed standards development
committees to do each, and got them

497
00:30:44,340 --> 00:30:48,520
up and running, relatively quickly given
that this was a very new initiative.

498
00:30:49,580 --> 00:30:52,020
By the way, the government acted very
quickly in developing this law.

499
00:30:52,020 --> 00:30:54,930
The government took power and O-, October
of

500
00:30:54,930 --> 00:30:58,620
2003, they had a bill introduced by
October

501
00:30:58,620 --> 00:31:01,100
of 2004 and it got third reading in

502
00:31:01,100 --> 00:31:04,296
May of 2005 after province-wide televised
public hearings.

503
00:31:04,296 --> 00:31:08,650
That's actually quite, prompt action by a
government,

504
00:31:08,650 --> 00:31:11,490
much less one that's just newly, taken
power.

505
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:17,100
After that, we came to realize fairly
quickly, when the experience of the

506
00:31:17,100 --> 00:31:19,280
first two standards development committees
that

507
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:21,250
hit the ground running, the one dealing

508
00:31:21,250 --> 00:31:24,530
with customer service and the one dealing
with transportation, that there were a

509
00:31:24,530 --> 00:31:27,070
number of significant problems happening
from a

510
00:31:27,070 --> 00:31:30,050
disability perspective at the standards
development table.

511
00:31:30,050 --> 00:31:32,240
This led us to go to the three political

512
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:35,530
parties in the 2007 election and actually
ask them

513
00:31:35,530 --> 00:31:39,360
to make election commitment, not for
legislative amendments, but

514
00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:42,770
for very specific actions on how they
implement these laws.

515
00:31:42,770 --> 00:31:44,900
Interestingly, all three parties, while
they don't agree

516
00:31:44,900 --> 00:31:47,910
on much, agreed on many of our proposals.

517
00:31:47,910 --> 00:31:50,519
What were the problems, what were our
proposals and what did we get?

518
00:31:51,730 --> 00:31:53,050
First.

519
00:31:53,050 --> 00:31:54,950
We found out, early on, that the

520
00:31:54,950 --> 00:31:58,800
government, appointed, when it selected
who it

521
00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,190
would appoint to these standards
development committee,

522
00:32:01,190 --> 00:32:04,280
people with disabilities were always the
minority.

523
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:05,330
That the number of public and

524
00:32:05,330 --> 00:32:09,040
private sector representation,
representatives, outnumbered them.

525
00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:12,660
So on any vote, if there was a debate
about how far

526
00:32:12,660 --> 00:32:17,840
the standard would go or should go, the
disability community always lost.

527
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:23,350
So we urged that 50% of the standards
development committees

528
00:32:23,350 --> 00:32:27,370
should each always be made up of people
with disabilities.

529
00:32:27,370 --> 00:32:28,910
And the government agreed.

530
00:32:28,910 --> 00:32:30,060
And by the way, it did make

531
00:32:30,060 --> 00:32:32,610
a significant difference, looking at what
happened afterward.

532
00:32:33,950 --> 00:32:37,300
Second, the way these standards of
[UNKNOWN] committees

533
00:32:37,300 --> 00:32:39,720
were working, at one side of the table,
you

534
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:43,660
had representatives, of public and private
sector organizations

535
00:32:43,660 --> 00:32:46,320
who often had access to a lot of
resources.

536
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:49,460
Government agencies and the Transportation
Standards Development Committee, in

537
00:32:49,460 --> 00:32:53,530
came all these public transit authorities
paid for by

538
00:32:53,530 --> 00:32:56,260
you and me a [INAUDIBLE] by the tax payer,

539
00:32:56,260 --> 00:32:58,858
who can hire lawyers and policy people and
someone.

540
00:32:58,858 --> 00:33:00,870
And the [INAUDIBLE] disability sector was
not only outnumbered,

541
00:33:00,870 --> 00:33:04,450
they were, outgunned in terms of access to
expertise.

542
00:33:06,430 --> 00:33:08,660
And we, they were often volunteers.

543
00:33:08,660 --> 00:33:10,930
They didn't have access to the supports
they needed.

544
00:33:10,930 --> 00:33:16,300
We asked the government in 2007 to provide
support to

545
00:33:16,300 --> 00:33:18,790
the disability sector so they could at
least be in a

546
00:33:18,790 --> 00:33:21,870
position to have an equal playing, a level
playing field

547
00:33:21,870 --> 00:33:24,510
when they debate these things in terms of
research and support.

548
00:33:25,930 --> 00:33:28,860
the, the liberal party, for their part,
promised

549
00:33:28,860 --> 00:33:32,130
to provide one staff person to provide
research support.

550
00:33:32,130 --> 00:33:33,400
And they did.

551
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:36,670
Not sure that was enough, but at least it
was a start.

552
00:33:36,670 --> 00:33:38,340
The third thing that we found out that was

553
00:33:38,340 --> 00:33:40,510
wrong, this is all learning by doing, by
the way.

554
00:33:40,510 --> 00:33:41,120
Like you can't,

555
00:33:43,220 --> 00:33:45,160
we, we didn't have a play book to work
from.

556
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:46,450
We were just figuring this out as we were

557
00:33:46,450 --> 00:33:48,810
going along, and to the government's
credit, so were they.

558
00:33:51,050 --> 00:33:54,134
But the third problem that we found out
with these standards of development

559
00:33:54,134 --> 00:33:55,990
committees, is that they weren't
consulting

560
00:33:55,990 --> 00:33:57,990
with the community other than where they

561
00:33:57,990 --> 00:34:01,910
statutorily had to and we thought that
there might be times there was

562
00:34:01,910 --> 00:34:05,570
a dispute or an issue coming up that was
worth them inviting people in.

563
00:34:05,570 --> 00:34:08,970
They had the statutory authority to but
let me give you a classic example.

564
00:34:08,970 --> 00:34:12,780
I was in the middle of litigation against
the Toronto Transit Commission personally.

565
00:34:12,780 --> 00:34:15,370
The forest of new announced subway
stopped.

566
00:34:16,710 --> 00:34:17,640
And later bus stops.

567
00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:20,690
And I had found out from some members of
the

568
00:34:20,690 --> 00:34:24,210
transportation standards committee that
they were having a real debate.

569
00:34:24,210 --> 00:34:27,990
The transit authorities didn't want to
require their drivers to call route stops.

570
00:34:27,990 --> 00:34:29,380
That may sound a little crazy.

571
00:34:30,490 --> 00:34:31,580
It was.

572
00:34:31,580 --> 00:34:34,320
But they were putting up a fight there,
just like TTC was

573
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:38,010
putting up a huge legal fight at the human
rights tribunal against me.

574
00:34:38,010 --> 00:34:40,570
So I wrote the committee and asked, can I
come to

575
00:34:40,570 --> 00:34:43,790
a meeting and at least pitch to you what
our concerns are?

576
00:34:43,790 --> 00:34:44,620
And they refused.

577
00:34:44,620 --> 00:34:48,210
I mean, I got in writing that they would
not allow me to come

578
00:34:48,210 --> 00:34:49,810
to a meeting, personally, to a meeting

579
00:34:49,810 --> 00:34:52,080
of Transportation Standards Development
Committee as a

580
00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:55,890
blind person to explain why it's important
For us to have drivers to call

581
00:34:55,890 --> 00:34:58,510
route stops, this seemed like something
was

582
00:34:58,510 --> 00:35:02,020
really seriously broken in their
deliberative processes.

583
00:35:02,020 --> 00:35:05,220
And remember this was taking place at the
point where the disability sector

584
00:35:05,220 --> 00:35:07,290
was outnumbered so they could never,
they'd

585
00:35:07,290 --> 00:35:09,880
lose every vote where there's a contest.

586
00:35:11,140 --> 00:35:13,750
And the other major problem that we found
out

587
00:35:13,750 --> 00:35:17,560
took place was that the way these
committees were working.

588
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:21,480
They were ultimately voting on proposals
all or nothing.

589
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:23,110
So they would discuss a bunch of proposals

590
00:35:23,110 --> 00:35:27,200
but eventually, the question would come
up, basically, here's

591
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:29,200
our proposal for an entire standard, do
you

592
00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:31,020
vote for it, or do you vote against it.

593
00:35:31,020 --> 00:35:34,160
And this put the disability sector in a
real bind,

594
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:37,559
because they might think the proposal is
absolutely weak and appalling.

595
00:35:38,980 --> 00:35:40,940
But if they vote against it, and it's
defeated, then

596
00:35:40,940 --> 00:35:45,060
nothing goes out for public comment, and
the process dies.

597
00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:49,400
So in the end, they end up having to vote
for it just

598
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:51,810
so it moves forward after which the

599
00:35:51,810 --> 00:35:54,820
proposal is released publicly with the
statement,

600
00:35:54,820 --> 00:35:58,910
everybody voted for it, so it makes it
sound like they were unanimous,

601
00:35:58,910 --> 00:36:01,180
in supporting a proposal that the
disability

602
00:36:01,180 --> 00:36:03,260
sector actually thought was way too weak.

603
00:36:03,260 --> 00:36:06,030
The transportation example is a good one.

604
00:36:06,030 --> 00:36:07,940
When it came to calling route stops, they
ended up

605
00:36:07,940 --> 00:36:12,030
in their initial proposal, recommending
that yes, public authority transit

606
00:36:12,030 --> 00:36:15,300
authority should be required to call all
route stops, but

607
00:36:15,300 --> 00:36:17,859
they should be given 18 years to start
doing it.

608
00:36:19,410 --> 00:36:20,610
I can't make this stuff up.

609
00:36:22,390 --> 00:36:25,990
So, the disability sector, reps came to us
and said this is not right.

610
00:36:25,990 --> 00:36:29,120
So we went to the government and we said,
"They should

611
00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:31,747
be able, why don't you change the way you
do this?

612
00:36:31,747 --> 00:36:35,527
Why don't they vote clause by clause like
you do in the legislature?"

613
00:36:35,527 --> 00:36:38,900
And if people oppose something let them
give their reasons.

614
00:36:38,900 --> 00:36:41,650
So when a recommendation comes out from
the committee.

615
00:36:41,650 --> 00:36:45,040
So the government, let's make public both
the recommendation and if people vote

616
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:48,770
against it, what, what the vote against it
was and what their reasons were.

617
00:36:48,770 --> 00:36:50,590
And this works for both sides.

618
00:36:50,590 --> 00:36:52,690
If something comes out, that some business
representatives

619
00:36:52,690 --> 00:36:55,590
think was too aggressive or the timelines
were

620
00:36:55,590 --> 00:37:01,640
too onerous let them vote against it and
say, you know, it passed 12 to 5.

621
00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:03,330
And the five could give their reasons why
they

622
00:37:03,330 --> 00:37:05,670
thought, so the government, and we the
public could

623
00:37:05,670 --> 00:37:09,810
read the results, and con-, and, and,
decide, what

624
00:37:09,810 --> 00:37:13,010
to recommend the government actually do
with their proposal.

625
00:37:13,010 --> 00:37:13,880
So.

626
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:17,990
The good news is, all these, the

627
00:37:17,990 --> 00:37:21,620
government committed, to pretty much all
of that.

628
00:37:21,620 --> 00:37:23,900
And implemented, I would say, most of it.

629
00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:28,650
Ironically, after the 2007 election, the
chair of the

630
00:37:28,650 --> 00:37:32,330
Transportation Standards Development
Committee on behalf of what was still

631
00:37:32,330 --> 00:37:37,280
a majority of non- disability
representatives, wrote the cabinet

632
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:39,740
minister, asking them to break their
election promise to us.

633
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:46,640
Which, after election usually politicians
say yes I'll take my election promise.

634
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:51,480
And they, they carried on under the new
regime.

635
00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:57,225
So that was our huge and interesting
process in learning how to fix it.

636
00:37:57,225 --> 00:38:01,750
Interestly-, troubling, though, was the
fact that the fix had to come from us

637
00:38:01,750 --> 00:38:05,170
during an election, going to the Premiere
and the two leaders of the opposition.

638
00:38:05,170 --> 00:38:07,120
When we made these proposals with the
government, they

639
00:38:07,120 --> 00:38:09,930
didn't, at lower levels, they didn't, they
didn't go anywhere.

640
00:38:11,420 --> 00:38:12,580
So that's 2007.

641
00:38:12,580 --> 00:38:16,393
Let me take you from 2007 to, to 2010.

642
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:18,950
What happened next?

643
00:38:18,950 --> 00:38:21,450
Well, then these standard develpoment
committees toiled

644
00:38:21,450 --> 00:38:23,040
away, worked very hard, came up with

645
00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:25,640
a series of proposals, actually between
then

646
00:38:25,640 --> 00:38:30,310
and 2011, and pardon me, 2010; that's
correct,

647
00:38:30,310 --> 00:38:33,460
released various proposals, interim
proposals, got input

648
00:38:33,460 --> 00:38:35,780
from the community, And came back you

649
00:38:35,780 --> 00:38:38,110
know with final proposals and the
government

650
00:38:38,110 --> 00:38:39,970
had them on their plate to develop
standard.

651
00:38:41,510 --> 00:38:45,610
The government enacted one standard in
2007 the first customer service.

652
00:38:46,900 --> 00:38:53,630
In 2011 in June it enacted another three
dealing with employment, information

653
00:38:53,630 --> 00:39:01,210
communication In transportation, all one
comprehensive or integrated regulation.

654
00:39:01,210 --> 00:39:08,950
In the end of 2012, they enacted part of
the built environment proposals,

655
00:39:08,950 --> 00:39:13,300
those that deal with public spaces outside
like, parking spots, sidewalks,

656
00:39:15,900 --> 00:39:18,670
recreational paths and a few other things.

657
00:39:18,670 --> 00:39:20,870
Things that deal with inside the building,
they've just

658
00:39:20,870 --> 00:39:23,750
passed a couple weeks ago, some amendment
to building code,

659
00:39:23,750 --> 00:39:27,000
but nothing under the nothing in the form
of a,

660
00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:30,420
an actual standard under the Accessibility
Frontiers of Disability Act.

661
00:39:32,220 --> 00:39:35,300
But, for your purposes let's not deal with

662
00:39:35,300 --> 00:39:37,710
the substance of what they pass but what
more

663
00:39:37,710 --> 00:39:39,370
did we learn and what more has developed
in

664
00:39:39,370 --> 00:39:42,800
terms of how to, how this regulatory
regime works.

665
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:47,055
Well nine, the next critical date is 2009
to 2010.

666
00:39:47,055 --> 00:39:53,800
'Cause while all this work was going on
the magic data rose in June of 2009.

667
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:59,760
That was four years after the disability
act was passed, and the government had

668
00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:03,610
to appoint its first independent review,
and

669
00:40:03,610 --> 00:40:05,980
that independent reviewer, who was
appointed is

670
00:40:05,980 --> 00:40:07,650
a gentleman named Charles Beer, a former

671
00:40:07,650 --> 00:40:11,150
Provincial Cabinet minister from the
eighties, and

672
00:40:11,150 --> 00:40:14,550
widely recognized from all perspectives as
a,

673
00:40:14,550 --> 00:40:19,070
a wise, thoughtful, attentive and fair
individual,

674
00:40:19,070 --> 00:40:21,350
he went out and held consultations talking
to the

675
00:40:21,350 --> 00:40:23,710
business community, this building
community, and government and so on.

676
00:40:24,720 --> 00:40:28,560
The message that he got from both the
disability

677
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:33,550
sector and the, the obligated sectors, was
that while

678
00:40:33,550 --> 00:40:35,330
the government had made a good effort at
making

679
00:40:35,330 --> 00:40:39,080
the standards development process work,
there was some real problems.

680
00:40:40,670 --> 00:40:43,080
There were four or five different
committees working on different

681
00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:46,090
problems, and there was no coordination
between any of them.

682
00:40:47,510 --> 00:40:50,830
A lot of them didn't quite understand what
it was they were supposed to be doing.

683
00:40:52,820 --> 00:40:56,800
Even after the changes in the process that
we wanted in 2007

684
00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:02,380
election, a number of them found that
they, a process was convoluted.

685
00:41:02,380 --> 00:41:06,230
There were also big committees, it was
hard to develop consensus and so on.

686
00:41:07,660 --> 00:41:11,560
We in turn when to the Behr.

687
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:14,760
Charles Bier, independent review, and
said, In addition, we're

688
00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:19,210
concerned that this whole process is not
even trying to

689
00:41:19,210 --> 00:41:22,110
develop accessibility standards that will
live up to the requirements

690
00:41:22,110 --> 00:41:25,700
of the Human Rights Code or the Charter of
Rights.

691
00:41:25,700 --> 00:41:28,550
Now at that point, Charles Bier only had
one standard that

692
00:41:28,550 --> 00:41:32,940
had been passed to look at, the 2007,
customer service accessibility standards.

693
00:41:32,940 --> 00:41:34,500
Remember, he's doing this in 2009.

694
00:41:34,500 --> 00:41:36,930
And the other standards weren't first
enacted,

695
00:41:36,930 --> 00:41:39,200
weren't, weren't enacted until two years
later.

696
00:41:40,390 --> 00:41:41,950
So he was dealing with process.

697
00:41:43,370 --> 00:41:44,680
The subject we're dealing with here.

698
00:41:45,710 --> 00:41:50,580
He also found that throughout all of this
there was very little understanding about

699
00:41:50,580 --> 00:41:53,040
the Disabilities Act or awareness of it

700
00:41:53,040 --> 00:41:56,050
among the obligated sectors, business and
so on.

701
00:41:57,190 --> 00:42:02,240
And he ended up rendering a report that
was tabled, the Charles Beer report.

702
00:42:02,240 --> 00:42:08,580
It's available, by the way, on on our
website, aodalliance.org.

703
00:42:08,580 --> 00:42:10,690
As well as our analysis of it.

704
00:42:10,690 --> 00:42:13,800
You read a report to the government in
February of 2010,

705
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:17,980
which the government studied and made
public on May 31st 2010.

706
00:42:17,980 --> 00:42:21,660
You basically reached the following
conclusion.

707
00:42:21,660 --> 00:42:25,260
You said the government means well, but
they dropped the ball.

708
00:42:25,260 --> 00:42:28,420
You said that really the government
celebrated the passage of

709
00:42:28,420 --> 00:42:31,890
this fund in 2005, then went back to
business as usual.

710
00:42:31,890 --> 00:42:35,250
And he said there was a real need for the
government to

711
00:42:35,250 --> 00:42:40,250
revitalize the implementation of this law
and to show new leadership on it.

712
00:42:40,250 --> 00:42:42,800
He echoed the concerns that people had
about how

713
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:46,930
the standards were being developed and
recommended some significant changes.

714
00:42:46,930 --> 00:42:48,320
First, he said the government should
appoint

715
00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:51,760
one minister responsible for all
accessibility issues.

716
00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:54,370
And the lead public servant on this file

717
00:42:54,370 --> 00:42:57,090
in the Ontario government was the
assistant deputy administer.

718
00:42:57,090 --> 00:42:58,450
They should be made a deputy.

719
00:42:58,450 --> 00:43:02,340
In other words they profile this within
the public service should be ratcheted up.

720
00:43:04,700 --> 00:43:09,050
He also proposed that the standards should
be harmonized.

721
00:43:09,050 --> 00:43:11,780
They shouldn't be dealt with in little
silos.

722
00:43:11,780 --> 00:43:13,980
They should be done in a coordinated, so
business

723
00:43:13,980 --> 00:43:16,230
could all know, and, and, the broad, and
the public

724
00:43:16,230 --> 00:43:19,120
sector, broader public sector could know
what they gotta do

725
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:23,080
with timelines that are coordinated among
themselves rather than scattergun.

726
00:43:23,080 --> 00:43:24,710
Which actually makes a good load of sense.

727
00:43:26,350 --> 00:43:28,970
But he also said that the process of how

728
00:43:28,970 --> 00:43:32,340
these standards are being developed should
be consolidated, instead of

729
00:43:32,340 --> 00:43:35,430
having five different standards
development committee, he was impressed

730
00:43:35,430 --> 00:43:37,860
from the, by the United States model under
the Americans

731
00:43:37,860 --> 00:43:39,980
with Disabilities act, where they have a
central access

732
00:43:39,980 --> 00:43:42,300
board, to develop a number of proposal, he
said the

733
00:43:42,300 --> 00:43:46,990
province, should amend the disabilities
act, to create a single

734
00:43:46,990 --> 00:43:50,160
body, arm's length from the government
with its own staff.

735
00:43:51,200 --> 00:43:54,760
That will develop accessibility standard
proposals.

736
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:56,750
Won't enact them, but will develop them.

737
00:43:59,764 --> 00:44:03,900
We rec-, we supported pretty much
everything he recommended, except a couple

738
00:44:03,900 --> 00:44:06,570
things that I haven't covered and that
don't matter and that are secondary.

739
00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:12,280
And we didn't hear anyone in the broader
public, discussion

740
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:15,780
of this issue from any side who opposed
what he proposed.

741
00:44:17,170 --> 00:44:19,580
So the next question is what's the
government done about it?

742
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:22,280
Well they took their time.

743
00:44:23,870 --> 00:44:25,440
I will tell you that they to this day have

744
00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:32,080
not appointed a single minister
responsible for all accessibility issues.

745
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:33,420
And we still have a problem in the

746
00:44:33,420 --> 00:44:37,420
Ontario government, the largest employer,
the largest service provider,

747
00:44:37,420 --> 00:44:44,060
the organization that describes itself as
being the wanting

748
00:44:44,060 --> 00:44:47,040
to, lead by example, in how to do
accessibility.

749
00:44:48,150 --> 00:44:51,179
We still have accessibility dealt with in
silos.

750
00:44:52,340 --> 00:44:55,000
Uncoordinated across the Ontario
government.

751
00:44:55,000 --> 00:44:56,310
There are some efforts to deal with it.

752
00:44:56,310 --> 00:45:00,360
There's been some progress, but there's
some unbelievable problems,

753
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:04,080
within the public sector that could've
been easily fixed.

754
00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:11,320
They have not elevated the assistant
deputy minister to be a deputy minister.

755
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:14,252
Essentially business has been as usual.

756
00:45:14,252 --> 00:45:19,870
Subject to one change that just took place
a year ago.

757
00:45:19,870 --> 00:45:24,040
And is not one he recommended but we are
delighted with.

758
00:45:25,050 --> 00:45:27,130
They moved the accessibility directorate
from

759
00:45:27,130 --> 00:45:28,830
the Ministry of Communications, Community
and

760
00:45:28,830 --> 00:45:32,160
Social Services to the Ministry of

761
00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:34,800
Economic Development and Trade, Trade
Unemployment.

762
00:45:36,030 --> 00:45:38,580
We were happy the government decided that
accessibility

763
00:45:38,580 --> 00:45:41,290
would be seen as an issue of economic
development.

764
00:45:42,670 --> 00:45:44,540
Not as an issue of social assistance.

765
00:45:45,690 --> 00:45:49,710
They haven't done a very much of a good
job of integrating it in

766
00:45:49,710 --> 00:45:52,050
their economic development strategy but at
least

767
00:45:52,050 --> 00:45:54,329
they, they took this step that was
symbolic.

768
00:45:55,720 --> 00:45:58,090
What did he, what have they done with his
proposal for

769
00:45:58,090 --> 00:46:01,720
how to reform the access, the process for
developing accessibility standards.

770
00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:08,130
Well the government, has done what it
could,

771
00:46:08,130 --> 00:46:11,560
within the confines of the statute as
drafted.

772
00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:15,160
We have made it clear publicly that we did
not want the Disabilities Act reopened.

773
00:46:15,160 --> 00:46:16,820
We don't want amendments to it at all.

774
00:46:16,820 --> 00:46:19,290
We don't want any fiddling with it.

775
00:46:19,290 --> 00:46:23,276
We want it to remain, sacrosanct.

776
00:46:23,276 --> 00:46:26,880
So the government looked at the
disabilities and they said well can we how

777
00:46:26,880 --> 00:46:28,930
can we do what Charles Bier recommended

778
00:46:28,930 --> 00:46:32,070
as much as possible without altering the
statue?

779
00:46:35,070 --> 00:46:36,860
So what they did is that they decided that
there was

780
00:46:36,860 --> 00:46:40,480
a body that already exists under the
statue that had very little,

781
00:46:42,720 --> 00:46:43,520
major role.

782
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:47,290
And they made it the new standards
development body.

783
00:46:47,290 --> 00:46:49,420
The body is called these government

784
00:46:49,420 --> 00:46:52,790
names, the accessibility standards
advisement council.

785
00:46:54,070 --> 00:46:58,040
It was created under the disabilities act
or extended under the disabilities act in

786
00:46:58,040 --> 00:46:59,210
2005 basically as a body that would

787
00:46:59,210 --> 00:47:02,270
give the minister general advice on
accessibility.

788
00:47:02,270 --> 00:47:05,260
I will tell you that governments often
have the accessibility, or

789
00:47:05,260 --> 00:47:09,490
pardon me, advisory bodies to deal with
various issues of social concern.

790
00:47:10,660 --> 00:47:14,950
My own lay, uninformed, and perhaps
speculative view

791
00:47:14,950 --> 00:47:17,940
that most of them don't get much real

792
00:47:17,940 --> 00:47:21,920
opportunity to have much impact, no matter
how good the people are who are on them.

793
00:47:23,190 --> 00:47:25,950
And there were really good people on this
body, but up until last,

794
00:47:25,950 --> 00:47:33,330
this past year, that council I don't
think, was used to its full advantage.

795
00:47:33,330 --> 00:47:36,190
And I'm not aware of, and we're not aware
of it having

796
00:47:36,190 --> 00:47:42,340
a substantial impact on the, efforts of
the government to achieve accessibility.

797
00:47:42,340 --> 00:47:46,230
Well the government says, well we got this
counsel anyway, why don't we use, next

798
00:47:46,230 --> 00:47:48,020
time we're gonna make any access
standards, let's

799
00:47:48,020 --> 00:47:50,350
appoint them to be the standards
deveopment committee.

800
00:47:50,350 --> 00:47:52,190
It'll be one body, it'll be all under one
roof.

801
00:47:52,190 --> 00:47:53,380
It'll be harmonized.

802
00:47:53,380 --> 00:47:54,510
It'll be together.

803
00:47:54,510 --> 00:47:59,620
It'll be ongoing, it'll be, it'll be a
consistent, process.

804
00:47:59,620 --> 00:48:00,439
We said great.

805
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:02,850
The good news is that a year ago the

806
00:48:02,850 --> 00:48:07,240
government made, announced that they were
gonna do this, but

807
00:48:07,240 --> 00:48:10,660
they took fully five months to appoint
anybody, maybe even

808
00:48:10,660 --> 00:48:13,400
six months to appoint anybody other that
their, the Chair,

809
00:48:15,500 --> 00:48:18,499
and they haven't given them any new
standards to develop.

810
00:48:20,910 --> 00:48:23,530
So, they've got the body ready to go.

811
00:48:23,530 --> 00:48:24,570
They haven't given him the work.

812
00:48:26,030 --> 00:48:29,240
In fact, the only thing that this counsel
has on

813
00:48:29,240 --> 00:48:32,930
its, on its RADAR right now, is that the
2007

814
00:48:32,930 --> 00:48:37,350
customer service accessibility standard
came up for its five year

815
00:48:37,350 --> 00:48:40,110
review last year and they've got to do
that review.

816
00:48:40,110 --> 00:48:41,580
We've not seen.

817
00:48:41,580 --> 00:48:43,960
Any sort of significant public action on
it,

818
00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:46,430
but we've been told it's on their, their
agenda.

819
00:48:46,430 --> 00:48:48,830
There are good people on that council.

820
00:48:48,830 --> 00:48:52,910
But, we're very critical of the government
for not actually giving the the work

821
00:48:52,910 --> 00:48:57,070
the, they need to do, once they were given
the mandate to do that work.

822
00:48:59,830 --> 00:49:03,520
Let me just spend a couple of minutes, so
that's where we are now.

823
00:49:03,520 --> 00:49:06,730
Now we have an-, let me, let me spend the
last, couple of minutes

824
00:49:06,730 --> 00:49:11,795
just taking you through a bit of where we
are now in this overall regime.

825
00:49:11,795 --> 00:49:14,810
Not, which barriers are fixed or which
ones need to be

826
00:49:14,810 --> 00:49:17,690
fixed, that's hugely important, we are
dealing with that in other lectures.

827
00:49:17,690 --> 00:49:19,950
But in terms of the perspective you folks
are taking

828
00:49:19,950 --> 00:49:23,660
which is looking at different regulatory
regimes for solving social problems.

829
00:49:25,170 --> 00:49:28,530
Number one, we have an independent review.

830
00:49:28,530 --> 00:49:32,421
And this is going to be right on that
reviewer's plate, you know, [UNKNOWN].

831
00:49:32,421 --> 00:49:34,840
The independent review is in a sense,
illustrative of the

832
00:49:34,840 --> 00:49:37,150
kinds of problems we've been facing as as
of late.

833
00:49:37,150 --> 00:49:39,180
We believe we're way behind schedule, we
are not gonna

834
00:49:39,180 --> 00:49:43,020
rechieve full acc-, accessibility by 2025
or, anywhere near then.

835
00:49:43,020 --> 00:49:46,690
The government was actually statutorily
obliged, to appoint the

836
00:49:46,690 --> 00:49:50,220
independent review by May 31st of this, of
last year.

837
00:49:50,220 --> 00:49:51,580
And they didn't.

838
00:49:51,580 --> 00:49:55,410
Actually ran an op-ed in the Toronto Star,
online, about the fact that they were

839
00:49:55,410 --> 00:49:59,070
actually in breach of their own law and
they remained in breach of their own law.

840
00:49:59,070 --> 00:50:02,620
We ran a daily count on Twitter for over a
hundred days.

841
00:50:04,950 --> 00:50:07,020
The government itself, not complying with
its own

842
00:50:07,020 --> 00:50:09,730
timelines, is hardly setting a good
example for

843
00:50:09,730 --> 00:50:11,970
our business and other public sector
organizations should

844
00:50:11,970 --> 00:50:15,210
do in obeying timelines they're supposed
to comply with.

845
00:50:15,210 --> 00:50:16,410
Under the disabilities act.

846
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:20,600
That's a huge, issue.

847
00:50:21,980 --> 00:50:26,644
Second, just to give you the sort of
current situation.

848
00:50:26,644 --> 00:50:27,280
What about enforcement of this law?

849
00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:28,185
What about enforcement?

850
00:50:28,185 --> 00:50:33,990
So remember I told you that in 2005

851
00:50:33,990 --> 00:50:37,530
the government included powers of
inspection, audit, compliance orders

852
00:50:37,530 --> 00:50:39,120
and so on, but kept them in-house within

853
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:42,350
the government, not assigning them to an
independent agency.

854
00:50:42,350 --> 00:50:45,600
Well, starting in 2010, there was
something to enforce,

855
00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:49,070
the customer service standard relative to
the public sector.

856
00:50:49,070 --> 00:50:54,250
And starting, last year, the start of
2013, the customer

857
00:50:54,250 --> 00:50:58,520
service standard, obligations were
enforceable is against the private sector.

858
00:50:59,660 --> 00:51:00,760
Well the government did some work with the

859
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:03,540
broader public sector but we chased them
for

860
00:51:03,540 --> 00:51:05,050
all of last year to find out what

861
00:51:05,050 --> 00:51:07,980
they were doing to enforce, in the private
sector.

862
00:51:11,140 --> 00:51:16,380
And we were able to do this focusing on,
one major question.

863
00:51:16,380 --> 00:51:22,350
Under the Disabilities Act Customer
Service Standard, any organization with

864
00:51:22,350 --> 00:51:24,490
20 or more employees that provides goods
or services to the

865
00:51:24,490 --> 00:51:27,910
public, had to file by the start of 2013
with the

866
00:51:27,910 --> 00:51:32,550
government, e-file, a compliance report,
just saying are you in compliance?

867
00:51:33,550 --> 00:51:36,550
So we wrote the government in the end of
January last year saying:

868
00:51:36,550 --> 00:51:39,390
how many files, how many didn't, and what
are you doing about it?

869
00:51:41,350 --> 00:51:42,078
They didn't answer.

870
00:51:42,078 --> 00:51:44,400
They didn't answer, they kept not
answering.

871
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:47,100
We kept raising it and they kept not
answering.

872
00:51:47,100 --> 00:51:51,210
So finally in August of last year, I filed
a Freedom of Information request.

873
00:51:51,210 --> 00:51:53,440
The government told me eventually, that
I'd have to pay $2,300

874
00:51:53,440 --> 00:51:57,900
and some odd dollars, to get them to
answer that request.

875
00:51:57,900 --> 00:52:00,490
I knew there would be, or I believed, that
you'd only have to push a

876
00:52:00,490 --> 00:52:03,080
button to get the information off the
computer,

877
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:05,220
of how many were in compliance, or not.

878
00:52:05,220 --> 00:52:07,890
And as for producing their plans for
enforcement, if they

879
00:52:07,890 --> 00:52:11,790
needed to spend $2,300 on public service
to find that plan.

880
00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:15,090
It mustn't be on the top of their desk.

881
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:24,540
Eventually, questions in the legislature,
and a an a, an editorial slamming the

882
00:52:24,540 --> 00:52:30,630
government on the Toronto Star led them to
hand over the documents, we were seeking.

883
00:52:30,630 --> 00:52:32,270
What did we find out?

884
00:52:32,270 --> 00:52:35,050
This was reported in the media last Fall.

885
00:52:35,050 --> 00:52:41,288
Of those private sector organizations with
20 or more employees, in Ontario,

886
00:52:41,288 --> 00:52:48,820
fully 70% had still not filed an
Accessibility Compliance Report.

887
00:52:48,820 --> 00:52:52,820
By November of 2013, over ten months after

888
00:52:52,820 --> 00:52:55,840
the legal deadline fro doing so, after
having been

889
00:52:55,840 --> 00:52:59,260
given five full years to prepare for
compliance

890
00:52:59,260 --> 00:53:03,300
with what is a relatively simple
regulation to me.

891
00:53:03,300 --> 00:53:06,190
We also found out through that, freedom
informational request that the

892
00:53:06,190 --> 00:53:07,880
government were conduct, had conducted no

893
00:53:07,880 --> 00:53:10,670
inspections of any private sector
organizations.

894
00:53:10,670 --> 00:53:14,380
No audits, they'd issued no compli-,
compliance orders,

895
00:53:14,380 --> 00:53:17,710
and not issued, imposed one dime of
monetary penalties.

896
00:53:17,710 --> 00:53:19,240
>> Now apart from that, they were doing
[CROSSTALK]

897
00:53:19,240 --> 00:53:20,728
>> Other than that they were doing a
great job.

898
00:53:20,728 --> 00:53:22,620
[CROSSTALK]

899
00:53:22,620 --> 00:53:25,520
>> We just have, maybe five minutes,
before the break.

900
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:25,830
Does that work?

901
00:53:25,830 --> 00:53:26,450
>> The break.

902
00:53:26,450 --> 00:53:27,750
Yeah, yep, absolutely.

903
00:53:27,750 --> 00:53:31,220
So, we, we, needless to say, enforcement
is a huge issue.

904
00:53:32,700 --> 00:53:37,960
I can't leave this topic, however, by,
leaving you to, with the, image

905
00:53:37,960 --> 00:53:43,720
of this being solely about regulations,
and about, compliance and enforcement.

906
00:53:43,720 --> 00:53:47,060
There are a number of other fronts to
complete the picture,

907
00:53:47,060 --> 00:53:50,360
and I'm gonna just list them quickly, and
then we wrap up.

908
00:53:51,880 --> 00:53:54,170
To achieve the goal of full accessibility
while

909
00:53:54,170 --> 00:54:00,400
the standards, development, enactment,
enforcement regime is critical.

910
00:54:01,470 --> 00:54:04,120
We have believed throughout that there are
a number

911
00:54:04,120 --> 00:54:07,720
of other parallel strategies that need to
be pursued.

912
00:54:09,310 --> 00:54:11,910
Let me list them and tell you what's going
on really quickly.

913
00:54:11,910 --> 00:54:13,080
And they're really interesting.

914
00:54:13,080 --> 00:54:16,750
Number one, government money talks.

915
00:54:16,750 --> 00:54:19,870
Government spends a fortune every year on
infrastructure,

916
00:54:19,870 --> 00:54:23,260
on capital, and on procuring goods and
services.

917
00:54:24,560 --> 00:54:31,000
We've called on the government to,
comprehensibly require that no public

918
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:36,710
money can be used to create barriers or
perpetuate or exacerbate barriers.

919
00:54:37,920 --> 00:54:41,510
We've gotten some progress, but lever of
power

920
00:54:41,510 --> 00:54:46,190
has largely been substantially unutilized
or under utilized.

921
00:54:48,640 --> 00:54:49,260
Number two.

922
00:54:50,730 --> 00:54:53,880
We believe from day one that it was
important for

923
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:58,730
the government to review all its own
legislation and regulations.

924
00:54:58,730 --> 00:55:01,090
To make sure they are, that they don't

925
00:55:01,090 --> 00:55:05,550
themselves impose barriers or authorize
the creation of barriers.

926
00:55:07,050 --> 00:55:11,680
And, in 2007, Premier Dalton McGuinty
promised that such a review

927
00:55:11,680 --> 00:55:14,800
would be done, said it was the next order
of business.

928
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:16,410
The government didn't even start doing it
for

929
00:55:16,410 --> 00:55:18,940
at least three or three and a half years.

930
00:55:18,940 --> 00:55:20,335
It's still under way now.

931
00:55:20,335 --> 00:55:23,403
Number three.

932
00:55:24,750 --> 00:55:29,260
There's some areas where individual
barrier er, some environments where this

933
00:55:29,260 --> 00:55:33,780
regulatory regime just sort of won't fit,
but where action is needed.

934
00:55:33,780 --> 00:55:35,200
Courts are a good example.

935
00:55:36,450 --> 00:55:38,800
You can't develop a standard for telling
judges

936
00:55:38,800 --> 00:55:40,280
how to deal with accessibility to the
court room.

937
00:55:40,280 --> 00:55:43,850
It's just not gonna, it just doesn't work
in the judicial environment.

938
00:55:43,850 --> 00:55:49,370
In 20 and, 05, our then Chief Justice, Roy
McMurtry after whom

939
00:55:49,370 --> 00:55:52,380
the fellowship I, I, I, have the honor of
having this name.

940
00:55:52,380 --> 00:55:58,320
He called on the judiciary to do their
part to achieve accessibility.

941
00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:00,590
He appointed a committed of the bench, the
bar of the

942
00:56:00,590 --> 00:56:04,589
government to develop a road map to make
the courts accessible.

943
00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:07,420
That report was submitted.

944
00:56:07,420 --> 00:56:09,720
I had the privilege of serving on the
committee that developed

945
00:56:09,720 --> 00:56:13,820
it under the leadership of Ontario Court
of Appeal Justice Karen Wiler.

946
00:56:13,820 --> 00:56:18,860
The Wiler Committee Report available on
the Ontario Court of Appeals Web site was

947
00:56:18,860 --> 00:56:22,870
tabled in 2007 and a permanent joint

948
00:56:22,870 --> 00:56:25,980
committee of the bench foreign government
of Ontario.

949
00:56:25,980 --> 00:56:28,670
The Ontario Courts Accessibility Committee
has been

950
00:56:28,670 --> 00:56:30,670
working since then, I'm a member of

951
00:56:30,670 --> 00:56:32,900
that committee, as well, on working on

952
00:56:32,900 --> 00:56:35,450
strategies to address barriers in our
court system.

953
00:56:37,790 --> 00:56:43,890
We, also need a comprehensive strategy,
for education.

954
00:56:44,980 --> 00:56:46,860
And really wanna target two groups.

955
00:56:46,860 --> 00:56:48,590
The natural thing you think of is
educating

956
00:56:48,590 --> 00:56:51,930
businesses and all, of course you gotta do
that.

957
00:56:51,930 --> 00:56:55,170
But we've called on the government to
develop a strategy for ensuring that

958
00:56:55,170 --> 00:56:57,720
schoolkids get education on accessibility
so

959
00:56:57,720 --> 00:57:00,030
that the next generation will know better.

960
00:57:00,030 --> 00:57:03,000
And also, for professionals like
architects, doctors,

961
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:06,450
nurses, and you bet, lawyers, who provide
services

962
00:57:06,450 --> 00:57:08,450
to individuals to know about, the barrier,

963
00:57:08,450 --> 00:57:11,930
the need to provide barrier-free, services
as well.

964
00:57:11,930 --> 00:57:13,830
At the very least, somebody who gets a
license to

965
00:57:13,830 --> 00:57:16,990
be an architect should know how to design
an accessible building.

966
00:57:16,990 --> 00:57:18,350
That ought to be pretty rudimentary.

967
00:57:19,490 --> 00:57:23,510
So far we have gotten far too little
action on that front.

968
00:57:23,510 --> 00:57:28,190
And finally, we believe that voters with
disabilities need

969
00:57:28,190 --> 00:57:31,870
to have full and equal access to the
ballot if

970
00:57:31,870 --> 00:57:34,380
our political clout is to be heard, and if

971
00:57:34,380 --> 00:57:37,380
governments are to be truly held
accountable on this issue.

972
00:57:37,380 --> 00:57:40,380
We estimate there's over a million voters
with disabilities.

973
00:57:40,380 --> 00:57:42,255
But too often, they face barriers in

974
00:57:42,255 --> 00:57:44,460
voting: either getting in the polling
station,

975
00:57:44,460 --> 00:57:45,270
or in the case of people who

976
00:57:45,270 --> 00:57:48,760
are blind or dyslexic, independently
marking your ballot.

977
00:57:48,760 --> 00:57:51,050
One solution we've been urging, is
telephone and

978
00:57:51,050 --> 00:57:54,440
internet voting, not only for us, but for
everyone.

979
00:57:54,440 --> 00:57:56,800
So far, Elections Ontario has been

980
00:57:56,800 --> 00:58:02,630
extremely slow, and, unreceptive to this
proposal.

981
00:58:03,760 --> 00:58:09,570
Let me conclude by saying that the 20
people who got together in that room,

982
00:58:09,570 --> 00:58:12,450
back 20 years ago this November, who

983
00:58:12,450 --> 00:58:16,480
started the movement that became the cross
disability,

984
00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:18,560
Ontarians With Disabilities Act Committee
and later

985
00:58:18,560 --> 00:58:21,770
the Accessibility for Ontarians With
Disabilities Act Alliance,

986
00:58:22,860 --> 00:58:26,080
our community started out not knowing
about

987
00:58:26,080 --> 00:58:28,780
anything that I've just spent the past
hour

988
00:58:28,780 --> 00:58:30,840
talking to you about, including me.

989
00:58:30,840 --> 00:58:31,486
None of us did.

990
00:58:31,486 --> 00:58:32,700
We've learned by doing.

991
00:58:32,700 --> 00:58:36,550
We've learned by having wonderful people
to advise us along the way.

992
00:58:36,550 --> 00:58:38,860
And we will continue to learn by doing.

993
00:58:38,860 --> 00:58:41,510
If you want to learn more about this,

994
00:58:41,510 --> 00:58:43,660
I encourage you to consider a couple of
options.

995
00:58:43,660 --> 00:58:46,430
One is we provide regular email updates.

996
00:58:46,430 --> 00:58:47,945
Just send a request to sign up to

997
00:58:47,945 --> 00:58:53,794
AODAfeedback@gmail.com, or follow us on
Twitter at @AODAalliance.

998
00:58:53,794 --> 00:58:57,130
Either way, you can find out a lot about
this.

999
00:58:57,130 --> 00:59:00,950
We are, a new source of unaccessability
here, and around the world.

1000
00:59:00,950 --> 00:59:03,650
Anyway, I welcome the chance to take your
questions, and I thank

1001
00:59:03,650 --> 00:59:05,990
you so much for the opportunity to speak
to you this afternoon.